May Have to Retire.....

smashedheadcat · 09-22-2002, 07:52 PM

Saturday afternoon my car bit the big one. I just don't understand how or why. Everything was done by the numbers. All clearances were carefully checked, i used all the right parts. At the 300 mile mark, i drained my oil, removed the filter, sifted through the old oil, cut up the oil filter and everything was perfect Great oil pressure, clean oil, everything. All was going as advertised. I've used nothing but Mobil 1 5W-20 FULL SYNTHETIC and Motorcraft filter(s). The car never got hot or anything.

So anyway, i'm on my way to the dyno (www.waynesdyno.net). The car is running perfectly. I'm on my way to get a quick tune just to be safe, and while i saved for the autologic chip and cage etc etc. I got into a quick acceleration contest with my buddy's '03 cobra. (I's victorious btw) Anyway, about an hour later, i stop at a red light. Right as i stop the oil pressure (autometer guage) falls down to about 8-10psi, then quick to snap back up to normal. **Factory guage holds steady** I turn the radio off, and hold my head outside and everything sounds wonderful. I continue ever so slightly forward, only to be stopped by the next red light. Same thing, but oil pressure falls to zero **Factory guage starts to drop off (to the "O" in NORMAL)** A quick tap of the gas restores oil pressure and I limp forward about 25 ft into a parkinglot and i shut it off. I get out of the car and pop the hood. I check the oil and everything is perfect... (about a 1/2qt high) Oil was clean and plentiful. I restart the car and everything is perfect, pressure on the AUTOMETER holding steady at about 35psi. A quick short rev lets out an audible knock. I shut it off, and put the top up, and continue up the street (about a mile away) to Waynes Dyno. After we dyno the '03 and watch a few others run, i tell him that my car sounds like i may have a spun bearing. We take a ride in the '03 cobra and he checks it out. He checks the oil, and asks me to fire it up. The most discusting sound i've ever heard came from under my hood. He screams to shut it off. "Spun bearing.." Wayne said. So now, i haven't the slightest idea how i'm going to pay to get this fixed. It's going to take me the better part of 6-8 months to raise the money to fix this thing. Sorry for the novel, but i had a lot of news to pass.

johnbasf · 09-22-2002, 08:37 PM

Sorry to hear that Josh. If that ever happens to me I'm going PUSHROD. You can do so much more to one of those. Don't get me wrong, I love the Mod Motor. You just can't do a lot to them and still be safe. Good Luck!!!!

**cobrabitn** · 09-22-2002, 09:41 PM

Sorry to hear that Josh!

Black Snake · 09-22-2002, 10:51 PM

Sorry to hear about the bad luck. That’s never a good thing to hear.

You really should not use synthetic oil in a brand new motor. You should put about 10K-15K on the clock before you make the switch. Also I would have put a good 1K break-in miles on the motor before doing any “quick acceleration contests”. I’m not saying that this contributed to your problem, just stating a rule of thumb.

Talk to your engine builder. If you really only have 300 miles on the new motor, I would be at his door first thing in the morning.

Good luck.

smashedheadcat · 09-23-2002, 12:19 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Black Snake
Sorry to hear about the bad luck. That’s never a good thing to hear.

You really should not use synthetic oil in a brand new motor. You should put about 10K-15K on the clock before you make the switch. Also I would have put a good 1K break-in miles on the motor before doing any “quick acceleration contests”. I’m not saying that this contributed to your problem, just stating a rule of thumb.

Talk to your engine builder. If you really only have 300 miles on the new motor, I would be at his door first thing in the morning.

Good luck.

Sorry if i wasn't perfectly clear. Changing the oil at the 300 mile mark was just something i've learned to do over the years. The car was shut off for the last time with 1176 miles on the new motor. Mostly highway miles. My engine builder drove it 100 miles or so before i got my paws on it. I put a few miles on it here and there (city miles) and then changed the oil. I then drove it from indiana to north carolina. Then after a few belt and pulley problems, i got it going again. It was well over 1000 miles before i put down. This engine hasn't seen over 6000 rpms because of the fact it's untuned. I opted for the Autometer Oil pressure guage instead of the fuel pressure guage just because of the new motor. I know oil pressure is more important at this point of the engine's life than fuel pressure (esp cuz it wouldn't have any high rpm pulls for awhile). The car ran very very strong in it's short life. Going pushrod would definately be wonderful, except that i have so much money wrapped up into this modular money pit that i can't part with it. Besides, i wouldn't be happy with anything shy of 300rwhp after rolling around in this car. Which would mean, i'd have to throw a ton of money into the new 5.0 and i just don't have the funds. I really need to hit the lottery or something. This is killing me.

Ken 01-Cobra · 09-23-2002, 04:00 AM

Damn Josh...that pretty much sux! I don't know what to tell you! Let us know what you decide to do.

Black Snake · 09-23-2002, 09:25 AM

I would still talk to my builder. That shouldn't happen to a recently rebuilt motor. Did he replace/upgrade the oil pump or oil pump gears?

smashedheadcat · 09-23-2002, 05:43 PM

The oil pump was replaced with FRPP High volume unit. **Not billet oil gears** I called up true blue this morning, and they said if i decided to have them do it, they'd take my motor in as a core, and give me another one with similar internals for about $3500 est. That's definately too much money for me. I only have about $800 now. I'm probably just gonna get a storage unit, and go to work on it. I'll drop the K-member, and slide the trans back and pull the crank out. I'll use my untrained eye to look for damage, and if it looks good, just turn the crank, replace the oil pump if necessary, new bearings and just toss it back in. That's really the only way i'll be able to get this thing going. I can't afford to redo this whole thing. I just can't. If it's too bad, i won't be driving this thing for 6 months minimum.

sfuller · 09-24-2002, 12:13 AM

Replacing the bearings and the crank is not all that difficult to do yourself once the engine is out of the car. Probably the biggest annoyance is the torque to yield bolts used on the mains, and the rod caps, as well as getting the main bearings off.

smashedheadcat · 09-24-2002, 06:04 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by sfuller
Replacing the bearings and the crank is not all that difficult to do yourself once the engine is out of the car. Probably the biggest annoyance is the torque to yield bolts used on the mains, and the rod caps, as well as getting the main bearings off.

Well, I've never really tried to do this before. I've put together a few Pushrod motors, so i'm hoping this is relatively the same. (bottom end anyway). Do I have to worry about messing up the cam timing or anything?? One more thing. I know that the factory main bolts require replacement because I guess the stretch when torqed.... Mine are ARP, so do they require replacement??? I'm going to go pick up my car on Sunday. I'll have it stuffed in a storage unit by sunday afternoon. Up on jack stands it'll go, and i'll get to work. I may order that "engine support" thing that Griggs sells. Or, make my own. Either way, i'm gonna be tearing into this thing. Worse case, i'll get it apart, mess it up, and pay someone to put it back together. Or worse yet, i'll get it apart, and it'll look like a junk yard under there.

sfuller · 09-25-2002, 12:33 AM

Quote:

Do I have to worry about messing up the cam timing or anything??

IIRC, there are marks on the gears on the ends of the camshaft as well as the gear on the end of the crankshaft to line up chains. The chains had some darker links on them as well to assist in getting things lined up. I would definitely get a the big blue Ford repair book as well as a Haynes manual before doing too much, and read over the procedures. You can also locate the Ford repair CDs on the net pretty easily as well. I would absolutely double check anything I stated above as it's from memory after working on one motor back around February - April with a friend.

Quote:

One more thing. I know that the factory main bolts require replacement because I guess the stretch when torqed.... Mine are ARP, so do they require replacement???

I believe that the ARP bolts are standard bolts, and not torque to yield. If they are not TTY, you should be able to reuse them. The people that worked on your engine before should be able to tell you for sure, as should ARP.

Hope this helps some.

smashedheadcat · 09-25-2002, 03:09 PM

That helps a lot. Here's another question. Lets say i'm only going to rip the crank outta there, turn it, and replace the bearings, and possibly the oil pump. How hard is it to get just the crank outta there. (I'm hoping i can just pull everything out of the bottom without having to take the motor completely out of the car)

98banana · 09-25-2002, 04:17 PM

Josh, Sorry to hear about your motor. I saw your comment about my available Cobra motor and wasn't sure until now what you were referring to.

I've never done what you're talking about with pulling the crank with the motor in, but it sounds like a heck of a chore. I would assume it would be easier to pull the motor than work under it like that. Especially if the tranny will be disconnected anyway.

If you have a trailer to get it to Columbia, bring it down here and we'll put it on the lift and drop the motor out. I can't lend a lot of expertise, but I can get my hands dirty with you if you want. There's a lot more locals around here that will probably pitch in too.

Definitely take Steve's advice on getting the manual. It'll definitely help.

Let me know if I can help...

sfuller · 09-26-2002, 12:40 AM

Quote:

Here's another question. Lets say i'm only going to rip the crank outta there, turn it, and replace the bearings, and possibly the oil pump. How hard is it to get just the crank outta there. (I'm hoping i can just pull everything out of the bottom without having to take the motor completely out of the car)

UGH.

Let's see if we can go through some of the steps.

Remove K member. Support Steering Rack
Remove crossover pipe
Remove transmission and move out of the way
Remove flywheel
Remove oilpan
Remove crank pulley and tensioner pulley
Remove timing chain cover
Remove timing chains so you can remove timing gear from crank shaft
Remove oil pump
Remove oil pickup and crank scraper.
Remove all of the caps from the rods
Remove all 5 bearing caps remembering that the crank is solid steel with balanced throws and is probably between 75 and 100 lbs.

These are the big steps as I remember them. Then think of being on your back about 25 - 30" from the engine. Am I making this ugly enough yet?

Not to mention that you have to remove the transmission and the K member, so you have to have some other way of supporting the engine.

Removing the engine is the only way to do this right.

smashedheadcat · 10-03-2002, 08:12 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by 98banana
Josh, Sorry to hear about your motor. I saw your comment about my available Cobra motor and wasn't sure until now what you were referring to.

I've never done what you're talking about with pulling the crank with the motor in, but it sounds like a heck of a chore. I would assume it would be easier to pull the motor than work under it like that. Especially if the tranny will be disconnected anyway.

If you have a trailer to get it to Columbia, bring it down here and we'll put it on the lift and drop the motor out. I can't lend a lot of expertise, but I can get my hands dirty with you if you want. There's a lot more locals around here that will probably pitch in too.

Definitely take Steve's advice on getting the manual. It'll definitely help.

Let me know if I can help...

Heh heh. Tom, I wouldn't want to use up the Banana's lift. I just couldn't do that. I'm going to start turning wrenches on this thing next weekend (Columbus Day maybe??). I guess the only real way to find out how much of a PITA this is... is to just try it. If i screw everything up, then i'll just set it on fire, and collect insurrance. He he he. That's a joke. Thanks for the offer Tom. But, we'll see how everything else pans out first.

09-22-2002, 07:52 PM	#1
smashedheadcat Registered User Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Geneva, Switzerland Posts: 1,727	May Have to Retire..... Saturday afternoon my car bit the big one. I just don't understand how or why. Everything was done by the numbers. All clearances were carefully checked, i used all the right parts. At the 300 mile mark, i drained my oil, removed the filter, sifted through the old oil, cut up the oil filter and everything was perfect Great oil pressure, clean oil, everything. All was going as advertised. I've used nothing but Mobil 1 5W-20 FULL SYNTHETIC and Motorcraft filter(s). The car never got hot or anything. So anyway, i'm on my way to the dyno (www.waynesdyno.net). The car is running perfectly. I'm on my way to get a quick tune just to be safe, and while i saved for the autologic chip and cage etc etc. I got into a quick acceleration contest with my buddy's '03 cobra. (I's victorious btw) Anyway, about an hour later, i stop at a red light. Right as i stop the oil pressure (autometer guage) falls down to about 8-10psi, then quick to snap back up to normal. Factory guage holds steady I turn the radio off, and hold my head outside and everything sounds wonderful. I continue ever so slightly forward, only to be stopped by the next red light. Same thing, but oil pressure falls to zero Factory guage starts to drop off (to the "O" in NORMAL) A quick tap of the gas restores oil pressure and I limp forward about 25 ft into a parkinglot and i shut it off. I get out of the car and pop the hood. I check the oil and everything is perfect... (about a 1/2qt high) Oil was clean and plentiful. I restart the car and everything is perfect, pressure on the AUTOMETER holding steady at about 35psi. A quick short rev lets out an audible knock. I shut it off, and put the top up, and continue up the street (about a mile away) to Waynes Dyno. After we dyno the '03 and watch a few others run, i tell him that my car sounds like i may have a spun bearing. We take a ride in the '03 cobra and he checks it out. He checks the oil, and asks me to fire it up. The most discusting sound i've ever heard came from under my hood. He screams to shut it off. "Spun bearing.." Wayne said. So now, i haven't the slightest idea how i'm going to pay to get this fixed. It's going to take me the better part of 6-8 months to raise the money to fix this thing. Sorry for the novel, but i had a lot of news to pass. __________________ Josh 2003 Oxford White Cobra Coupe Twin Turbo Solid Axle Automatic Return Fuel System 1997 Triple Black Cobra Convertible Forged and Blown. 511rwhp 398 rwtq Sold

09-22-2002, 08:37 PM	#2
johnbasf Registered User Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Lewisville,NC Posts: 2,674	Sorry to hear that Josh. If that ever happens to me I'm going PUSHROD. You can do so much more to one of those. Don't get me wrong, I love the Mod Motor. You just can't do a lot to them and still be safe. Good Luck!!!! __________________ John Pearson

09-22-2002, 09:41 PM	#3
cobrabitn Dr Jekyll on the street, Mr Hyde on the track Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Rock Hill SC Posts: 14,649	Sorry to hear that Josh! __________________ Cobrabitn 2016 Ruby Red Metallic with Caribou accent F-350 Crew Cab Stump Puller! 6.7 Diesel Automatic with Chrome Package, Off Road Package, 3.55 Locking axles, and Ultimate Lariat Interior Trim Package! 2017 Shelby GT350 Coupe - track car! Mods: JLT True Cold Air oil catch can 2009 Vista Blue Shelby GT 500 Coupe - Garage Queen Tinted Windows JLT True Cold Air Kit Pro-Dyno Tune 526 rwhp - 511 rwtq 1994 Rio Red Indy Pace Car #22 "Runabout" Snake in the grill MGW shift knob 1996 SVT Cobra Wheels 1969 New Lime Mustang Mach 1 Sportsroof - Second owner - bone stock with shaker. One SVT Cobra, one Shelby GT500, one 69 mach 1, and a Shelby GT350 is better than nothing! Custom Data Plates for your Mustang or Ford! Buy "Cool Merchandise" at Data Plates Plus www.dataplatesplus.com See my MSR Video here!

09-22-2002, 10:51 PM	#4
Black Snake Moderator Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Lexington, SC Posts: 275	Sorry to hear about the bad luck. That’s never a good thing to hear. You really should not use synthetic oil in a brand new motor. You should put about 10K-15K on the clock before you make the switch. Also I would have put a good 1K break-in miles on the motor before doing any “quick acceleration contests”. I’m not saying that this contributed to your problem, just stating a rule of thumb. Talk to your engine builder. If you really only have 300 miles on the new motor, I would be at his door first thing in the morning. Good luck. __________________ Rob Maurer 93 Cobra: Vortech S-Trim, ARF 165’s, TFS Stage I cam, 42# injectors, Kirban AFPR, Pro-M 80, AFM Power Pipe, MSD 6BTM, MSD Blaster Coil, fuel pressure and boost gauges, 255 Walbro in-tank pump, T-Rex, 130 amp 3G alt, Fluidyne radiator, Mark VIII fan, 1 5/8" JBA unequal length shorties, Bassani off-road X-pipe and cat-back, Maximum Motorsports Caster Camber Plates, D&D tubular K-member & coil overs, Tokico Illumina shocks/struts, Global West LCAs, 3.73 gears, Pro-5.0 shifter, Winger letters 02 Corvette Z06: LG Pro Long Tubes, GHL Catback

09-23-2002, 04:00 AM	#6
Ken 01-Cobra Registered User Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Atlanta Posts: 764	Damn Josh...that pretty much sux! I don't know what to tell you! Let us know what you decide to do. __________________ Ken's Home Page <-- Click to visit!

09-23-2002, 09:25 AM	#7
Black Snake Moderator Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Lexington, SC Posts: 275	I would still talk to my builder. That shouldn't happen to a recently rebuilt motor. Did he replace/upgrade the oil pump or oil pump gears? __________________ Rob Maurer 93 Cobra: Vortech S-Trim, ARF 165’s, TFS Stage I cam, 42# injectors, Kirban AFPR, Pro-M 80, AFM Power Pipe, MSD 6BTM, MSD Blaster Coil, fuel pressure and boost gauges, 255 Walbro in-tank pump, T-Rex, 130 amp 3G alt, Fluidyne radiator, Mark VIII fan, 1 5/8" JBA unequal length shorties, Bassani off-road X-pipe and cat-back, Maximum Motorsports Caster Camber Plates, D&D tubular K-member & coil overs, Tokico Illumina shocks/struts, Global West LCAs, 3.73 gears, Pro-5.0 shifter, Winger letters 02 Corvette Z06: LG Pro Long Tubes, GHL Catback

09-23-2002, 05:43 PM	#8
smashedheadcat Registered User Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Geneva, Switzerland Posts: 1,727	The oil pump was replaced with FRPP High volume unit. Not billet oil gears I called up true blue this morning, and they said if i decided to have them do it, they'd take my motor in as a core, and give me another one with similar internals for about $3500 est. That's definately too much money for me. I only have about $800 now. I'm probably just gonna get a storage unit, and go to work on it. I'll drop the K-member, and slide the trans back and pull the crank out. I'll use my untrained eye to look for damage, and if it looks good, just turn the crank, replace the oil pump if necessary, new bearings and just toss it back in. That's really the only way i'll be able to get this thing going. I can't afford to redo this whole thing. I just can't. If it's too bad, i won't be driving this thing for 6 months minimum. __________________ Josh 2003 Oxford White Cobra Coupe Twin Turbo Solid Axle Automatic Return Fuel System 1997 Triple Black Cobra Convertible Forged and Blown. 511rwhp 398 rwtq Sold

09-24-2002, 12:13 AM	#9
sfuller Registered User Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Des Moines, IA Posts: 59	Replacing the bearings and the crank is not all that difficult to do yourself once the engine is out of the car. Probably the biggest annoyance is the torque to yield bolts used on the mains, and the rod caps, as well as getting the main bearings off. __________________ Steve Fuller 96 Mystic Cobra 00 SVT Contour

09-25-2002, 03:09 PM	#12
smashedheadcat Registered User Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Geneva, Switzerland Posts: 1,727	That helps a lot. Here's another question. Lets say i'm only going to rip the crank outta there, turn it, and replace the bearings, and possibly the oil pump. How hard is it to get just the crank outta there. (I'm hoping i can just pull everything out of the bottom without having to take the motor completely out of the car) __________________ Josh 2003 Oxford White Cobra Coupe Twin Turbo Solid Axle Automatic Return Fuel System 1997 Triple Black Cobra Convertible Forged and Blown. 511rwhp 398 rwtq Sold

09-25-2002, 04:17 PM	#13
98banana Registered User Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: North, SC Posts: 1,789	Josh, Sorry to hear about your motor. I saw your comment about my available Cobra motor and wasn't sure until now what you were referring to. I've never done what you're talking about with pulling the crank with the motor in, but it sounds like a heck of a chore. I would assume it would be easier to pull the motor than work under it like that. Especially if the tranny will be disconnected anyway. If you have a trailer to get it to Columbia, bring it down here and we'll put it on the lift and drop the motor out. I can't lend a lot of expertise, but I can get my hands dirty with you if you want. There's a lot more locals around here that will probably pitch in too. Definitely take Steve's advice on getting the manual. It'll definitely help. Let me know if I can help... __________________ Tom Lewis Nothing fun to drive...

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